Isle’s comment on yesterday’s post ended up really, really bugging me:
I’ve been attending church my entire life, and have never witnessed ‘obvious’ spiritual gifts of prophecy or tongues like you describe. I don’t doubt that they exist (indeed, your story is encouraging in that respect) but I wonder why I’ve never observed them in myself or the people around me. Is it my circumstances or my perspective? Or are they really that rare?
I googled here, here and here, checking on facts.
Here’s my findings: 3.5% of Americans are designated as Pentecostals or Charismatics, which means they have some spiritual gifts (usually speaking in tongues). But here’s the kicker: only 10% of this small group states they prophesy or give interpretations.
Thus, only .35% of Americans prophesy. And guess what? Most of these people are clustered in the southern states which are known as the Bible Belt.
Put your thinking caps on, okay? Do you see this as a problem for our churches, our cities, our states or America?
Swimming Upstream appears at this blog site on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays. It’s a little of this and a little of that, all written to encourage and exhort believers in their Christian journeys.
Larry Who 
People giving prophetic words is fairly common in our church. In fact it is common enough that we have had to place a simple protocol in place to maintain order. I would have to admit that the actual percentage of our congregation that gives prophetic messages is fairly small. I believe this is more due to a general fear of speaking before people than anything else. Still I see more and more people moving in this all the time.
I feel the larger problem in the US with the spiritul gifts is poor teaching and denominational fear that it would cause problems . The Bible is clear on the subject, we simply need to follow its teaching.
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I tend to agree with kingdomkeysbooks:
“I feel the larger problem in the US with the spiritul gifts is poor teaching and denominational fear that it would cause problems.”
I also think that many Christians prophesy without realizing it. We speak things into existence with our mouths – whether good or bad – never understanding we’ve created something with our words. Dangerous!
But oh, how much good we can do by lining up with God and His Word, speaking forth His truth!
kingdomkeysbooks and seriouswhimsey,
Thanks for your comments.
I agree that one of the problems is teaching on the spiritual gifts, especially prophecy. But even those who have been taught about prophecy probably have to relearn some of their stuff.
How can this be done in a short period of time?
Jesus prophesied the total destruction of Jerusalem in Luke 19: 42-44. He stated “you and your children within you” would be slaughtered.
His prophecy was fulfilled almost forty years later (70 A.D.) when the Roman General Titus laid siege to the city for several months. People ate dove dung and anything they could sink their teeth into. Some ate young children and afterbirth. Eventually, 1.1 million citizens, mainly Jews, were killed by the sword or starvation.
Now, Eusebius, a third century church historian, stated that an oracle (prophecy) was given to the Christian community around 66A.D., so that every Christian left the city and moved sixty miles away to a city named Pella. They left their homes, their jobs, everything, and fled before the Romans attacked Jerusalem. Not one Christian died in fall of rome.
Now, could we expect prophecies like that today in America? No, I don’t think so; not now anyway.
We only have approximately .35% of Americans who can prophesy. Most of them are hamstrung by rules and regulations at the churches they attend. And many others are too fearful to prophesy.
We need thousands of new people who can prophesy above the entry level of just saying, “I feel impressed that God really loves us.”
Do you see the dilemma we Christians are facing? We have this great spiritual weapon (prophecy) wrapped in chains, not being used.
I think it was two books ago I read that it wasn’t (or it could have been both) a prophecy but the Romans who offered the gentile Christians the opportunity to leave, that they would let them out. It was the betrayal of that, seen as abandonment that began the chasm between them and the Jews. It could be either, but my imaginator suggests both.
Note: I base this on nothing more than that source, what you say, and my instincts.
Jane,
Eusebius reported that because the Jewish Christians left Jerusalem, the Jews felt the Christians were disloyal to Israel. Thus, a big schism between the Jews and Christians began at that time.
Here’s a thought that might have bearing on your issue. Very few new Christians have a strong enough gift to begin as you did, and for that reason, prophesying in a large group is a scary venture. Most budding prophets know they’re vulnerable–prone to error–and unwilling to step out.
Beginning in smaller groups can be helpful. If participants know each other, they can encourage–and they can help each other discern what comes from God and what comes from the flesh. As one who has walked the road, I know the flesh enters if we open the door just slightly. But if we’re willing to submit to one another in love, we can learn about ourselves–and we can identify problems with attitude, etc. With time we might be ready to prophesy in a larger assembly–and become a conduit of powerful words that deeply impact others. But if prophesy must be given before large groups, it will always be a limited gift. Most of us need time to grow.
Solveig,
Bingo!
This is what I think: The only way to learn quickly how to prophesy at a high level is through small groups, maybe up to 12 people in the group. There a person can make mistakes and learn how to do it properly without the biggest nemesis of all – the fear of man.
And who says people ever have to prophesy in big groups. We have the internet. A true prophetic word for a locality will be just as good coming from a group of 12 as it would be from a group of a 1000. The Holy Spirit is the same, right?
Now, think about this, okay? Most of our prophetic words are coming from the top down, meaning people in leadership or ministry positions. This is dangerous. We are not getting full input from the whole Body of Christ.
I believe that we are in a different season than last year. We need to train thousands to hear the voice of God and prophesy.
I’m thinking this might be an important revelation/concept. I hadn’t thought about top-down prophetic words meaning we’re hearing from only part of “member” of the Body of Christ. Any group–even a group of people in leadership or ministry–speak from a limited perspective. And that’s dangerous because, in order to grow as a Body, we need to hear from all members.
I think part of the issue includes a misunderstanding (or even a denial) of the Holy Spirit’s role in our lives. Any gift of the Spirit, including prophecy of course, comes directly from the Holy Spirit and being able to hear it.
I have spent the last 10 years worshipping in the Church of Christ, a denomination not historically known for its Spirit-filled love. I love my current congregation and respect the leadership there. But like many churches, we have “progressive” and “old-school” members. A couple of years ago we had a retreat on the Holy Spirit, and some people couldn’t even grasp that the Spirit speaks today. Let alone the gift of prophecy!
I have been filled with urgency about particular matters in our local congregation, and I’m moving very slowly forward. I talked with a mentor (a lifelong CofC member) about this urgency, and she practically whispered back that a lot of people are feeling that way now. But nobody vocalizes it in the group.
I also felt called to share something with our elders, about preparation. I’m not sure how it was received, and I pray that God will work in them to His desired outcome, whatever that may be. It is nice to know that the Spirit will work in them, too. A checks and balances of sorts, in case I have misinterpreted.
Some people think this is crazy talk, others are more open but hush-hush. Should we have outright prophecy in our main assembly, some of the old-school members would likely be looking for a new church.
Anna,
Sometimes we plant, sometimes we water, but it is God who gives the increase.
I, too, have a few experiences along these lines back when I was a member of the Catholic Church. The priests probably thought I needed an exorcism because I bugged them so much. They eventually caved in and started a charismatic group which caused a whole bunch of people to meet Jesus and be filled with the Holy Spirit.
You just never know what will happen when you obey the Holy Spirit to the best of your ability.
Anna, it’s nice to hear someone mention CofC online!
I’ve been attending one Church of Christ or another my entire life. Although I’m passionate about the CofC tradition, I often wonder how a so-called “restoration” movement can have such a hard time with the Spirit. I’ve also noticed that there’s a kind of movement within the churches in my area, and the spectrum of “traditional” and “progressive” CofCs is stretching wider, with a strong emphasis on being spirit-led in more progressive churches. I don’t know if this is happening in other denominations as well.
Sometimes I feel like I’ve missed some 101 classes, growing up in a Spirit-shy church. I like the idea of prophecy small groups, but how do I know if God has gifted me with prophecy? Or with anything, really? Obviously, it’s His choice who he gifts to prophesy, so how do you go about finding thus-gifted people to form such a group, especially when there seem to be so few?
Also, (since I’m a Spirit-beginner) can any stake be placed in those Spiritual gifts analysis tests? I generally score high on things like teaching and pastoring, neither of which I’ve had much opportunity to exercise as a young man. Is it possible that my God sort of has my gifts “on hold” for some later circumstance?
Sorry for the deluge of questions. I’m rather curious.
Isle,
Your curiosity shows that God is trying to move you somewhere spiritually.
I took one of those analysis tests years ago and it didn’t make much of an impression on me. Maybe it would now? I’m not sure.
But what has been most useful is LOTS of time poring over Scripture, and lots of time in prayer. Oh yeah, and I asked God for spiritual eyes. And He gave them to me. I “saw” through prayer, and tested everything against the Word.
All of this was internal. I became very frustrated in those days, if I tried to talk with someone at church about this “awakening” happening with me. I think I would have gone nuts if not for the Spirit’s reassurance to me that this is all part of the Christian life. Since then God has blessed me with two Spirit-led mentors and an online support group (Larry you are part of this, thank you!) Regardless, I continue to soak myself in the Word and pray — nothing else substitutes for this.
In Bible classes I try to call attention to the Holy Spirit. In the CofC we understand the Father and the Son, but without the Spirit we forfeit our power. Some people gravitate toward me because of this, others avoid me. This is how I find like-minded people, although I am far from forming a prophesy group at this time. 🙂
Hope this helps. Just keep praying, let the Spirit guide you into your own gifts and how you’re meant to use them.
Isle, Anna.
Just some thoughts regarding your spiritual gifts analysis tests.
When I first came across them I was immediately very grieved in my spirit. I knew something was grossly wrong with the very concept, but I didn’t know why.
Having done two of them to please other people’s insistence I now know they are a tool for fools.
These tests are basically using the Tree of Knowledge to assess the Spirit of God.
If what you have experienced is from a similar source to the two different ones I did, they will have asked a whole load of questions with perhaps tickboxes to give a score rating for their relevance to your gifting.
At the end you add up the column values and compare it to a chart where it will pronounce you as a prophet or teacher etc.
There is one problem with this idea. If you are not actually moving in any of the gifts of the spirit, but your experience of Christian life is more church programme and agenda based, then your answers will be also based on your fleshly experience. If the gifts that God has given you lie unopened, or under the control of the flesh then the same will apply. In no way will such a test analyse what has no external evidence.
My two unconnected attempts at the tests, were about two years apart and from different ministry sources. I was so appalled at the results, because I already know and move in my gifting, that I decided to go through the tests in reverse to try and link the questions which had been contributory to their given result.
When I found those questions I was horrified at the way such questions could be used to assess God’s hidden agenda for his children.
All I can say to those who use worldly psychological profiling to determine the secret things of God, “SHAME ON YOU”.
Such things may belong to recruitment and training agencies, but not in the realm of the spirit
Frank,
Well said.
Paul and Barnabas were not informed of their callings (Acts 13:1-3) by taking a test, but rather, through the Holy Spirit. (Most likely a prophetic word.)